Oh, that little moment with the dad on the pavement is everything. Comfort asked for, comfort given. Kids that small just can't settle themselves down yet, so they borrow our calm for a while until they slowly learn to do it on their own. That's probably why it's so rough to hear a little one just left to cry by themselves. Some part of you already knows they're not supposed to have to figure that out alone yet.
Wow. As someone who has worked in public education here in New York state for 21 years. This was very hard for me to read. Sometimes I think we could do with reinstilling at least a small amount of personal responsibility in the States, but this is perhaps too much. I honestly had no idea. It's always interesting to learn about the nuances of society, and this, to be honest, was a very surprising one to encounter through your writing. Thanks for sharing.
Wow interesting. I will say that after spending lots of time in international circles, there’s a few nationalities that have a distinct reputation, shall we say. The Swiss, the Argentinians, are known in a certain way. And this seems to explain why, at least for the Swiss…
Holy shit raising a child in Switzerland has been an absolute nightmare. The whole personal responsibility is a ruse: its parents absolutely abdicating their responsibility.
Swiss culture is absolutely risk adverse so they push the responsibility on everyone. And you can see it. Whether it’s in the office, in governmental agencies and with children.
When my kid was 2, another kid around 7 years old was throwing these huge Styrofoam Block in his head aggressively. I went to the parent and I said you need to get your son off of my child. She’s like oh they need to work it out. Are you fucking kidding me?
And my kid was bullied so much in public school that he’s traumatized. I had to pull them out and put them in a private school, which is medically necessary because he’s also autistic.
Swiss society sucks. I’ve been here for 20 years. In the beginning was great a typical expert with you now. Nice job traveling all the time. Because for me, Switzerland is either a place visit or a nice place to come home too. You can’t stay in this country for too long of a time it will do your damn head on.
Oh, and the fact that there’s absolutely no support for families here. Switzerland, by far of any country I’ve ever lived in is the absolute worst for families. Especially women who become mothers with schools closing for two hours every day for lunch, your kid doesn’t even go to school “full-time “until they’re like in year three or four. School closing on Wednesdays. No activities after school you’re responsible for driving them around.
Oh, and the fact that the philosophy of Swiss public school system is, they’re just supposed to give the bear basics . It’s your responsibility to actually educate your child. To the point where you actually get a taches educatives , like a little bonus, in your retirement for providing education for your child.
Trust me, I want to move for many years yet for certain reasons it’s just not feasible at the moment. In my opinion, Swiss culture is absolutely anti family.
Oh, for the kids who get hurt? If you go over and console them… You get the worst looks. And sometimes the parents get really upset. It’s like they want their children to suffer.
Oh, and another on the public schools: I’m a single parent where the father disappeared to South America, cut off all ties, blocking me with his parents responsibility. I have to go back to court to get a signature to pick up a passport… Hasn’t paid child support in years. So it’s obvious I have to work full-time to care for my autistic child and make sure that he has his provisions.
The public school can only accommodate by reducing his schedule to 60%. Which already puts him at risk because with autism social integration is already a challenge. So after five years of going circles with these fuck wits, I pulled my kid out out of that school.
Midway throughout his public schooling, it was obvious that he needed more support in the classroom. And the dean of the schooling system actually asked me well. Have you considered only working 50% so you can be more available for your child. And I said well, have you considered paying all of my bills so I can do this? And she said well that’s absurd of course we can’t do that and I responded. It’s absurd for you to ask a single parent without support payment to work 50%.
And I remember when I informed them, I’m taking out of the public school putting him into the private school up the hill, they all looked at me and said wait you can afford private school? I said yes absolutely even without a child support payment I can afford all our bills and private school.
Amen to this. And I think that only protects you from this if you have a really good well-paying job… Because as soon as you have to touch on the system to support you? There is fucking hell to pay. The Swiss are punitive. I mentioned a couple other threads here, I have wanted to get out for so long but for very specific reasons, we just can’t at the moment.
That sounds absolutely, heartbreakingly awful. I do not have children…save for a few in my life, whom I mostly adore, I just don’t really enjoy them. But hearing a child in genuine distress kind of undoes me in ways I can’t even quite explain. I feel their anguish and want to make it better. It’s important to learn to self-soothe, but you have to recognize when a kid’s not able to, and be that presence they depend on.
Elizabeth, I never thought about this being part of a 'Swiss parenting style.' I cannot abide screaming children, but thought it is just because I am one of those overly sensitive people whose auditory system short-circuits easily. For the record, my son did not whine or scream or meltdown. He was easygoing as a kiddo; the moments of the quivering lower lip were always easily resolved.
You are quite right about what happens when the 'please help me' is ignored, though: 'But here, the group looks away, society tells the victim they’re at fault, and the victim believes it.'
This unresponsive society did not help my son to learn personal responsibility, as Swiss kids are supposed to, but damaged him.
Thanks for the eloquent and thought-provoking read (and lucky you, holed up in Chiswick!).
When I write about Switzerland, I always have you in mind as my ideal reader. You're smart and know both sides. When you don't call me to account for getting it wrong or being unfair in my judgements (because I have a few...), I breathe a sigh of relief.
Oh gosh, that’s quite a responsibility, Elizabeth! And an accolade, as well. It’s always a treat to read your thoughtful writing—let me know when you’re back in Basel, maybe we will have some Swiss overlap this year!
Try working at a school - some kids can scream for hours, every day for 3 weeks even- or longer. Parents have tried, school psychs and social workers have tried - to soothe , to no avail. These children would just stay home from school every day - if they could- and then the meltdown would transfer to any given outing of the day or week, bc the child would not want to leave home at all. The event in UK and the school situation are entirely different .
Any way, what is a parent or school to do ? It’s not an easy fix for some kids, and there often is no bully. I live in US , and am not Swiss fwiw. It seems this might occur in a lot of countries.
Beautifully written. The arc that takes us from serenity to anguish, the pause that finishes the report, contemplating where the arc will end. Does it hit so hard because it echoes what I feel about the land that once was home?
As a father with 2 boys (4&5 years old), temper tantrums are a regular occurrence in my life. Sometimes I can get to the emergency shut off button before the everything melts down like Chernobyl, but honestly, sometimes I just don't have it in me and my inner Swiss shines through. Just reading your description of the school kid tantrums stressed me out *deep breathe* LOL.
Simon, the mere act of looking for the emergency shut-off is everything. Sure, sometimes you can’t find it; sometimes they need to cry it out, but you don’t leave them on the sidewalk for 45 minutes while you scroll your phone until they're too exhausted to move, which I have seen. That’s when I need to take deep breaths!!
Oh, that little moment with the dad on the pavement is everything. Comfort asked for, comfort given. Kids that small just can't settle themselves down yet, so they borrow our calm for a while until they slowly learn to do it on their own. That's probably why it's so rough to hear a little one just left to cry by themselves. Some part of you already knows they're not supposed to have to figure that out alone yet.
Not lately. That's for damn sure.
Humanity doesn't do nuance, does it?
Wow. As someone who has worked in public education here in New York state for 21 years. This was very hard for me to read. Sometimes I think we could do with reinstilling at least a small amount of personal responsibility in the States, but this is perhaps too much. I honestly had no idea. It's always interesting to learn about the nuances of society, and this, to be honest, was a very surprising one to encounter through your writing. Thanks for sharing.
Wow interesting. I will say that after spending lots of time in international circles, there’s a few nationalities that have a distinct reputation, shall we say. The Swiss, the Argentinians, are known in a certain way. And this seems to explain why, at least for the Swiss…
Holy shit raising a child in Switzerland has been an absolute nightmare. The whole personal responsibility is a ruse: its parents absolutely abdicating their responsibility.
Swiss culture is absolutely risk adverse so they push the responsibility on everyone. And you can see it. Whether it’s in the office, in governmental agencies and with children.
When my kid was 2, another kid around 7 years old was throwing these huge Styrofoam Block in his head aggressively. I went to the parent and I said you need to get your son off of my child. She’s like oh they need to work it out. Are you fucking kidding me?
And my kid was bullied so much in public school that he’s traumatized. I had to pull them out and put them in a private school, which is medically necessary because he’s also autistic.
Swiss society sucks. I’ve been here for 20 years. In the beginning was great a typical expert with you now. Nice job traveling all the time. Because for me, Switzerland is either a place visit or a nice place to come home too. You can’t stay in this country for too long of a time it will do your damn head on.
Oh, and the fact that there’s absolutely no support for families here. Switzerland, by far of any country I’ve ever lived in is the absolute worst for families. Especially women who become mothers with schools closing for two hours every day for lunch, your kid doesn’t even go to school “full-time “until they’re like in year three or four. School closing on Wednesdays. No activities after school you’re responsible for driving them around.
Oh, and the fact that the philosophy of Swiss public school system is, they’re just supposed to give the bear basics . It’s your responsibility to actually educate your child. To the point where you actually get a taches educatives , like a little bonus, in your retirement for providing education for your child.
Trust me, I want to move for many years yet for certain reasons it’s just not feasible at the moment. In my opinion, Swiss culture is absolutely anti family.
Oh, for the kids who get hurt? If you go over and console them… You get the worst looks. And sometimes the parents get really upset. It’s like they want their children to suffer.
Oh, and another on the public schools: I’m a single parent where the father disappeared to South America, cut off all ties, blocking me with his parents responsibility. I have to go back to court to get a signature to pick up a passport… Hasn’t paid child support in years. So it’s obvious I have to work full-time to care for my autistic child and make sure that he has his provisions.
The public school can only accommodate by reducing his schedule to 60%. Which already puts him at risk because with autism social integration is already a challenge. So after five years of going circles with these fuck wits, I pulled my kid out out of that school.
Midway throughout his public schooling, it was obvious that he needed more support in the classroom. And the dean of the schooling system actually asked me well. Have you considered only working 50% so you can be more available for your child. And I said well, have you considered paying all of my bills so I can do this? And she said well that’s absurd of course we can’t do that and I responded. It’s absurd for you to ask a single parent without support payment to work 50%.
And I remember when I informed them, I’m taking out of the public school putting him into the private school up the hill, they all looked at me and said wait you can afford private school? I said yes absolutely even without a child support payment I can afford all our bills and private school.
I could do a whole post on the tyranny of lunchtime.
Hell, I’ll join you in it. Good Lord.
The Swiss are so fundamentally evil; this is under appreciated
Amen to this. And I think that only protects you from this if you have a really good well-paying job… Because as soon as you have to touch on the system to support you? There is fucking hell to pay. The Swiss are punitive. I mentioned a couple other threads here, I have wanted to get out for so long but for very specific reasons, we just can’t at the moment.
That sounds absolutely, heartbreakingly awful. I do not have children…save for a few in my life, whom I mostly adore, I just don’t really enjoy them. But hearing a child in genuine distress kind of undoes me in ways I can’t even quite explain. I feel their anguish and want to make it better. It’s important to learn to self-soothe, but you have to recognize when a kid’s not able to, and be that presence they depend on.
Elizabeth, I never thought about this being part of a 'Swiss parenting style.' I cannot abide screaming children, but thought it is just because I am one of those overly sensitive people whose auditory system short-circuits easily. For the record, my son did not whine or scream or meltdown. He was easygoing as a kiddo; the moments of the quivering lower lip were always easily resolved.
You are quite right about what happens when the 'please help me' is ignored, though: 'But here, the group looks away, society tells the victim they’re at fault, and the victim believes it.'
This unresponsive society did not help my son to learn personal responsibility, as Swiss kids are supposed to, but damaged him.
Thanks for the eloquent and thought-provoking read (and lucky you, holed up in Chiswick!).
When I write about Switzerland, I always have you in mind as my ideal reader. You're smart and know both sides. When you don't call me to account for getting it wrong or being unfair in my judgements (because I have a few...), I breathe a sigh of relief.
Oh gosh, that’s quite a responsibility, Elizabeth! And an accolade, as well. It’s always a treat to read your thoughtful writing—let me know when you’re back in Basel, maybe we will have some Swiss overlap this year!
Try working at a school - some kids can scream for hours, every day for 3 weeks even- or longer. Parents have tried, school psychs and social workers have tried - to soothe , to no avail. These children would just stay home from school every day - if they could- and then the meltdown would transfer to any given outing of the day or week, bc the child would not want to leave home at all. The event in UK and the school situation are entirely different .
Any way, what is a parent or school to do ? It’s not an easy fix for some kids, and there often is no bully. I live in US , and am not Swiss fwiw. It seems this might occur in a lot of countries.
Beautifully written. The arc that takes us from serenity to anguish, the pause that finishes the report, contemplating where the arc will end. Does it hit so hard because it echoes what I feel about the land that once was home?
I think it's also because you're an exceptionally caring parent.
As a father with 2 boys (4&5 years old), temper tantrums are a regular occurrence in my life. Sometimes I can get to the emergency shut off button before the everything melts down like Chernobyl, but honestly, sometimes I just don't have it in me and my inner Swiss shines through. Just reading your description of the school kid tantrums stressed me out *deep breathe* LOL.
Good Reads as always Elizabeth 👌🏼
Simon, the mere act of looking for the emergency shut-off is everything. Sure, sometimes you can’t find it; sometimes they need to cry it out, but you don’t leave them on the sidewalk for 45 minutes while you scroll your phone until they're too exhausted to move, which I have seen. That’s when I need to take deep breaths!!
Yes that's extreme. I'd need to relieve my own pain far sooner than that! Lol, so I'd dog deep and lean in